Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

He/him/his. #BLM. Blogging about the downloadable side of the tabletop RPG and wargame hobby. printandplaygamer.com Joined May 2018

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@DragoncrownG @SJGames @Wizards_DnD Yeah. None of them really knew what they were doing, once real money started rolling in. iirc, the Blumes colluded with Williams to oust Gygax, and then she ousted them, before nearly wrecking the company by investing things like D&D-brand needlepoint kits. (It's a hobby, right?)

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@DragoncrownG @SJGames @Wizards_DnD Gygax was Jobs to Arneson's Wozniak. If Gary hadn't secretly maneuvered to cut out Dave against his will, and they'd parted amicably, I'd be more forgiving. It's telling that every change in TSR leadership involving Gygax was acrimonious (Arneson, the Blumes, Williams...).

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@JustinaRevolut1 @Man_O_War_Speak I love those two as well, but I'd call them D&D-adjacent. They represent innovative departures from core D&D which change how the game feel and plays at least as much as 4e changed from 3.5, and 5e changed (back) from 4e. (Now I need to reread the 4e books to decide if it's D&D!)

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@Man_O_War_Speak 4/4 The #OSR is an style of play and a movement that includes the pre-Wizards editions of D&D and its clones, but it also covers non-dnd games like Traveller, TFT and Runequest. If you intend to exclude those games, you need to say "OSR DnD."

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@Man_O_War_Speak 3/ d20 games in non-Fantasy Genres, such as Star Frontiers, Gamma World, and Stars Without Number are certainly dnd-adjacent, but have enough mechanical differences to not be dnd.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@DM_CurtF @Man_O_War_Speak I disagree. I can easily run a campaign that fits those thematic criteria using GURPS, Fantasy Age, Hero System, Savage Worlds, Fate or Dungeon World. A game system is defined by core mechanics (d20, 6 stats, classes and levels), not themes which will vary from table to table.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@JustinaRevolut1 @Man_O_War_Speak I agree with these two criteria, but I'd also add classes and levels (which are sufficiently interconnected to be a single criterion) for a game to be a version of D&D. If your game uses 6 stats and a d20, but uses a classless skill system, it's just D&D-adjacent.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@DragoncrownG @SJGames @Wizards_DnD Fair enough. My hackles get raised whenever Gygax is credited posthumously as the "creator" of DnD, or when he's remembered as deferring to DMs' rulings over DnD's rules. He was like that in the mid-70s, but by the publication of AD&D, he saw HIS rules as binding on the hobby.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@mmindadventures Sure, it's a great question, but readers will be better served if you refer people to read and contribute to the original thread, rather than starting a redundant conversation which diverts interest generated by the OP's question as engagement credited by Twitter to you.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@nachv46 @imagine07161 @the_rbeagle @roxyred808 If we want to recruit and retain the best quality personnel as teachers, and we expect them to hold graduate degrees, we need to pay salaries and respect commensurate with those standards. Otherwise, we will continue to lose our best teachers to other fields.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@nachv46 @ricdisi @imagine07161 @the_rbeagle @roxyred808 I wasn't talking to you. We'd already agreed to disagree. I say again: Good day, sir!

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@DragoncrownG @SJGames @Wizards_DnD I have no opinion about the "best" version of D&D; I'd rather play Hero System. I just feel that Gygax gets unjustly sanctified by modern gamers. I was there at the time of TSR's ascendancy, and he very much saw himself as the "final arbiter" of fantasy roleplaying.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@DragoncrownG @SJGames D&D is a far better "big brother" to the rest of the hobby under @Wizards_DnD than it ever was under TSR. Even under Hasbro, WotC is a better neighbor than Gygax's TSR. The general a$$hattery of the "new" TSR totally befits the legacy of that company. 2/2

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@DragoncrownG I was an editor at @SJGames through the 80s, and I can assure you that the attitude of Gygax & TSR management (which continued under Lorraine Williams) toward the rest if the hobby was decidedly hostile and dismissive. The creatives were pleasant guys, but the company sucked. 1/2

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@suzidao You'll notice no one ever whines about Bridge not working for five players (and 2- and 3-handed Bridge are really just Bridge-adjacent at best). And I've never heard of anyone attempting 3-player Chess.

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Print and Play Gamer @pnpgamer

5 years ago

@OldShabbyGamer @Svartalf6 @martinmattl @Man_O_War_Speak By B/X, I meant to include every non-A version of D&D that came before 3e, from the White Box through Holmes, Moldvay to the Rules Cyclopedia, which are essentially mechanically compatible, and were published in parallel with the mechanically different 1e and 2e AD&D.